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is this clear? windfall for shareholders - ala Mar 11, 2007


If done correctly - ie simply to recoup the total of the abatement amount itself, then non sponsor shareholders experience a windfall. The sponsor's being assesses subsidizes the amount.

some buildings make the mistake of assessing for the total amount of the abatement that appreas on the non-sponsor maintainence bills and forget to do this math.


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maybe you can address this? it has to do with possible overbilling.


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Is this right? PLease read with care.
Let's say your apartment has a monthly mainteinance of $ 1000. Your tax credit (coop/condo) is $400 to be given to you by May. Your bill for May is then $600.

BUT the board decides to assess for the total of the abatement given to all shareholders in the building. (ie you will pay your portion of the abatement as it is divided among ALL shareholders inc. sponsor - who does not eligible for the credit).

Your portion of this is $250. (because the sponsor has to pay but does not realize the tax credit, which means you pay less than he does and proportionaly less on your bill than the actual credit of $400.) Got it?

You would then be assessed (your portion) but also have a nice windfall of $150 for your May bill . Is this clear? help someone.


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The best math you can do is asking your maangement agent for the tax invoice and exactly figuring out what is the amount of tax each shares is supposed to pay to the City.




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Here is a very simple explaination of the situation and the two ways of basing an assessment that is related to the anual abatement:

Please note ADC's very strong opinion on this. A wonder he did not seem to remember this:

Sat Apr 8, 2006 8:23AM
70.23.184.148

1) method one: the entire buildings abatment is the basis.

2) method two: individual unit's abatment is the basis.

If I had to guess I'd say more buildings use method 1 than method 2 but both are used.

Do you want to maximize the buildings income without penalizing the shareholder? Use method 2.

Do you want shareholders to fee that they at least got some of the abatement? Use method 1.

AdC
Method 2 is ridiculous!
Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:14AM
63.103.93.62

I think I got to the bottom of the problem! You seem to favor method 2 for being "lucrative" and punishing to the sponsor.

First, boards should be motivated by transparency in operations. Ergo, if you are raising the amount of the abatement then declare it as such and don't charge above and beyond.

If you wish to increase the reserve by another $X, then do so and EDUCATE your shareholders for the need to increase reserves for whatever reasosns are demanded:

Thinking you get something from the sponsor may be counterproductive. Fairness in operations will lead a sponsor to cooperate with you more times than not. Sponsors too can read through the lines and regard the board of your building as a crooks and unprofessional. Temptation is great, but you lose your credibility too!

Sorry, but this is my opinion.

AdC




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Re: abatement and assessment, at this point I'm forgetting who said what and even who originally asked the question.

To whoever brought this up - have you talked to your coop's CPA or accounting dept? If I overlooked or forgot this, I apologize for asking. They should advise you on the best method to use and how to calculate it, and do all the math for you. If you're paying them to do a job, let them do it.

Advice here is valuable but I think an inordinate amount of time and effort is being expended on this discussion. And if the person who brought this up has made sense of all the replies and come to any definitive conclusions, you're a better man than I am, Charlie Brown.


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window replacement ( to anonymous) - Fat Nickie Mar 11, 2007


I have to agree with Mike McGowen, you should not bad mouth a company/vendow without backing up the facts. Can we also not all be anonymous when we post articles.

Fat Nickie


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Windows and heating - BP Mar 11, 2007


If your co-op's central heating is very uneven, I'd look into that more closely. If some units roast while others are cold, maybe the fault is with how heat is distributed through the system. If so, that can be a problem no matter what new windows you install. A good engineer can make recommendations, including possibly installing individual heat level adjusters in each unit.

I agree that Pella windows are expensive. They seem to be "hot" right now, but if your co-op can't afford them, it would be financially imprudent to get them, and the extra cost can be better spent on something else. We have thermal barrier, aluminum windows with 7/8" insulated glass. They look nice, work well, reduce noise, and run $350-$400 per window. I believe you can get the baked enamel finish in white, black or copper color. We have the standard white.

If your co-op's 12 units all have the same old windows, you should replace them all. You can schedule the coldest units first, but it takes only a few days per unit. You can do them all fairly quickly if you plan ahead with the window vendor and shareholders. Budget for ALL the work. You can't do 4 units now and hope to do the rest later. What if you don't have money for the rest later? The project will drag out, shareholders will complain, and the building won't look very nice. Also, Business Corp Law requires that you treat all shareholders fairly and equally. You can't do something for some of them that you don't extend to all of them in a timely and equitable manner.

Just my two cents.


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Thanks,BP. Do you have a vendor in the NYC area you would care to refer us to? Also, as regards replacing all the windows, my feeling is that the units that are warm and have no visible degradation of their windows will not want to spring for the added expense. I agree that doing them on an as needed basis/worst case scenario case is best and to budget for all who need it, but we don't get to take any energy improvement deductions on the building if that. We recently did a 13th month assessment and most shareholders are expecting a lobby improvement to happen from that, and even if we deferred that, it still would not give us enough to undertake complete replacement even if we used this money for that.


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I see your point, Newbie. If you only replace some windows, one consideration should be consistency in terms of style and color, otherwise it will detract from building appeal. Based on our experience and that of other boards I know, here are a few "pro" and "con" vendor names:

City Landlord Services - 718-894-2632 - doing windows for years but switched distributors not long ago. The windows they offer now are cheaper quality but prices are the same, even a bit higher, and service is not reliable.

All Glass - don't know their number, think they're in the Bronx, heard their work and prices are good.

Panorama Windows - don't know their number, do good work but prices are high for windows you can get elsewhere.

Shapiro & James - 718-292-3000 - prices a bit higher but worksmanship is A-1, service is excellent, go out of their way to satisfy customers, also do all types of mirror work.

If interested, I'd suggest contacting Shapiro & James and All Glass for more info and estimates.


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